Weltall8000 Says:

Nov 19, 2008 - You are still making a large assumption, that the genetics are being manipulated for that end, in DP society. Yet, ZAFT was not shown attacking anyone in all of GSD, that didn't attempt to attack them first. Not to mention, ZAFT never attacked Scandenavia, whom rejected DP as well. The thing is, you have your facts all wrong and you are drawing conclusions off of false information/opinions. I've not said Coordinators don't manipulate their genes, I said they don't for specific social control.

Weltall8000 Says:

Nov 19, 2008 - So, basically, you've finally realized that you are wrong, but don't want to admit it. What you don't get is that you can't soundly make accusations and presume someone guilty when you don't have evidence to support it. You speculate Durandel is wrong, but don't have any good examples that merit the argument that he's a tyrannical dictator. Thing is, you ASSUME what the DP is, without actual evidence from the series. I'm not doing that. You've also misread the entire ending of GSD as well.

Weltall8000 Says:

Nov 19, 2008 - Actually anne, no, he didn't. Those who oppose the DP, are enemies of mankind. Even the word oppose is different from the word reject. The opposing nations, outright attacked ZAFT, Orb and NA. The one nation shown to simply reject DP, Scandenavia, was never threatened nor attacked. And yet, you are ASSUMING that his next move will be to fire on those that oppose DP. Not a lick of evidence from the series supports your argument. Copeland sent a fleet of warships AFTER contacting ZAFT for peace

Weltall8000 Says:

Nov 19, 2008 - The only distortion here is your bastardization of the series. You are trying to give vague sentences definite meaning, you are trying to take events out of the context in which they occur, you unduly have a bias against ZAFT based on your own personal opinion, rather than by merit. However, you fail each and every time to provide a time that Durandel fired on Orb the nation. Fukuda says Kira and Lacus are in the wrong, Durandel's point of view isn't. Actually, they'd laugh at your argument.

Weltall8000 Says:

Nov 19, 2008 - However, what I said was that Rey didn't have much of a future left, as he was going to die soon, I was speaking temporally, not the quality. Yes, actually that can hinder his dreams. Yet again, I acknowledge Rey and Rau are distinct individuals, never said they weren't. What actually makes you think Durandel really believes they are the same person? He's not stupid, he knows they aren't the same. He likely chooses Kira's dream because he's hopeless then and was swept up in Kira's rhetoric.

Weltall8000 Says:

Nov 19, 2008 - Third section "reject DP"* in place of "oppose".

bambambeam Says:

Nov 20, 2008 - as i can see what youve been trying to tell is just your own opinion,saying what series implied to us is different,judging from how YOU define DP i think you REALLY lack it,you failed to see what Destiny plan is AS THE NAME SUGGEST IT,i cant blame for someone like you misinterpret,if any person knowledgable in DP or GSD would read this he will think you as a fool no offense,why?dont get me wrong YOU really misinterpret dp i suggest you go research more it will be good for you

bambambeam Says:

Nov 20, 2008 - judging from how you comment this,dont think too highly of yourself as someday you will get what you deserve,I have a lot of evidence maybe we can settle this in a proper way?can we continue this in a forum?so we can analyze things well if would mind?i really pity you on how you describe destiny plan.

bambambeam Says:

Nov 20, 2008 - so you dont believed genetics are manipulated and assigned in DP? OK lets take it that way if you want it,assuming that it genetic manipulation was not involved how will you think it will solve world`s problem about wars huh?you said dullindal NEVER fired orb RIGHT?thats the most stupid claim ived ever seen by an animefan like you WHY? the last shot of requiem was for orb dullindal clearly said that!you make yourself stupid enough for this claim, though it was thwarted in time enough

Weltall8000 Says:

Nov 20, 2008 - Not only implications, but out right explicitly shown events. I'm merely relaying what is known about the DP. It selects jobs for people, it solves social problems. Other than that, not much else is known about how it functions. You can't just spout off what you think it will do and then attribute characteristics to it, that neither the series nor director point out. What's in a name? A rose by any other name smells just as sweet. Only fools like you would find me a fool for this.

Weltall8000 Says:

Nov 20, 2008 - What have I said that at all leads you to believe I have low self esteem? Also, what do you mean "someday I'll get what I deserve"? Your evidence has been logically refuted. The amusing part is, you don't realize that yet. If you want to go to a forum, I often go to seed-forum, if you wish to go there, knock yourself out. Your argument will get torn to shreds again, but at least there won't be a 500 character limit to each reply.

Weltall8000 Says:

Nov 20, 2008 - In the sense that it is for social control, no, genes won't be manipulated. It will solve the social problems and causes of war in CE Gundam. As explained before, Fukuda says it does, in his fictional world, he's the authority. If he says DP works, it does, neither you nor I can argue it. If he said something like it would work in real life, certainly, we could dispute it, but he's not saying that at all. Because he didn't fire the WMD on Orb the nation as I said. Provide me with a time he did

bambambeam Says:

Nov 21, 2008 - it will,its not just as simple as social control,similar to orb?orb was comnbination naturals & coordinators with same priviledge so they dont need it actually,what they been trying to reject was gil was trying to subdue the urge,greed and wrong desires generally as he said that he found a way of solving it using the most advance genetics,it was easily understood for most geneticist,as some of the fansites and forum dedicated to it described it that way..that why wars will become obsolete

bambambeam Says:

Nov 21, 2008 - understanding the DP yes it solve the main problem of CE as fukuda says it but he describes it as different way much way different than yours,merging them into one will not just solve all these problems eventually may problems will arise and CE will turn as it was in the begining:jealousy&insecurity of naturals towards coordinators..fukuda`s defintion of DP is much different than yours thats why..originally DP will cost much freedom in thoughs and speech as you will guided "genetically"

Weltall8000 Says:

Nov 21, 2008 - Not exactly sure what your talking about the first couple of sentences, if you wouldn't mind clarifying. Your sources being fansites, don't really lay down solid evidence from the series. While they may or may not have valid viewpoints drawn from the series, you can't exactly say, "because fansites say this, it is so", without some reasonable explanation supported by evidence from the series to back it up. Actually, Fukuda doesn't describe it in a vastly different manner than I.

Weltall8000 Says:

Nov 21, 2008 - You don't believe DP will work, that's nice, Fukuda does. In a discussion of his universe, Fukuda > you. What you are doing is breaking his fictional government down to why it would logically not work. I agree, applied to the way our world works, DP wouldn't work. However, in CE, it just does, Fukuda claims it and it is just a given, DP works, Gundams work, Coordinator technology works, etc. Your argument hardly makes sense at this point, not to mention disregarding major points of contention.

bambambeam Says:

Nov 22, 2008 - i didnt not mention that,what ived said is opposite,you even dont have any idea how does it work,it will work because as mentioned in the series genes will be the "king" and dullindal will be the "highpriest",the problem is fukuda`s DP is much different then your DP likewise you just make up your own impression and meaning of DP and failed to emphasize how it will really work not just as fukuda says it will.

bambambeam Says:

Nov 22, 2008 - you just failed to explain it well how will DP works just by merging the naturals & coordinators in one,problem will arise just as the begining of the CE era:greed,jealousy,insecurity etc. dullindal mentioned he just find a way to subdue that desires using the most advance genetics carefully plan by him in many years he will do it and finally make wars obsolete,if the DP os just as simple as you say,i guarantee it will not work,Fukudas DP with genetic enhancement & assigning genes can solve it.

SanderRX Says:

Nov 22, 2008 - Know whats funny?SF shot down LESS then 25 MS.I counted 17 on my KMPlayer right now...commander guy must be: A)Retard B)Counting units that Gaia and Strike Rouge defeated before SFs launch.

Zerokaiser00 Says:

Nov 22, 2008 - what is DP? seriously..

Weltall8000 Says:

Nov 22, 2008 - It chooses jobs for the people within it (based on genes), Coordinators and Naturals are integrated, as a result social problems are solved. In this fictional world, it works. I don't think DP would work in real life, but that is a different matter. In CE, it does. No, actually Durandel never claimed he'd be "king". He'd most likely lose some power in the DP as he would be subject to the DP organizational structure. By my agreeing with how his DP works in his series, "my" DP is much different?

Weltall8000 Says:

Nov 22, 2008 - Yes, by citing what's actually told about DP, I'm making stuff up. What again, you are still missing, is that is one of the two major things that are said to fix things in CE by DP. Coordinators and Naturals are integrated, they are together, so they will have more empathy for each other. Secondly, everyone has the "perfect" job, individually selected for them, so they get the feeling they have their own place in the world, as opposed to being out of place and the accompanying frustration.

Weltall8000 Says:

Nov 22, 2008 - Yet, we see Fukuda claiming that Durandel IS doing what's best for CE and we also see a successful DP society on Mars, in CE. What you are doing, is going directly against what Fukuda is saying about the series. In CE, the DP actually works. Real life, it probably wouldn't, but again, that's not the issue we are talking about. He studied genetics, however that does not mean he's going to alter them to forcibly control the population, that's just your own conjecture. Fukuda says it does however

Weltall8000 Says:

Nov 22, 2008 - DP = Destiny Plan. A major plot point late in Gundam Seed Destiny.

SilentAussie Says:

Nov 22, 2008 - Now THAT THAT..is how to own a bitch in 2min and 34sec. 8D